I'm back...

...and I have news.

See you soon.

On respect, anonymity and freedom of speech

Oh dear, what have I done? It seems the speculation over my identity, which I thought so amusing, has turned nasty and led to people abusing each other and naming names (twice so far, and different - you can't both be right can you?). I'm not at all happy to see my efforts distorted into personal abuse, whatever the reason. I'm also displeased that someone seems to think it amusing to name their candidate for the Whistler mantle. As much as I regret taking some of the fun out of this blog, for the sake of the innocent I'd better tell you all who I'm not. I am not:

• A market trader
• A shopkeeper
• On the staff of GSM/USM
• An employee of the Hospital
• An employee of NBRE
• A journalist
• A restaurateur
  
• A publican
• Somebody obsessed with their personal profits
• The Sugar Plum Fairy

I've probably missed some things out, and if you find yourself singled out for attention as a result, I'm sorry. Don't bother asking around either. No-one knows who I am, not even my family and friends. That's what made the guessing-game so much fun for a while. Now I see there is a risk of the innocent suffering for my amusement - hence this post.

So who am I? Someone who cares passionately about Greenwich, its markets (all of them), its small businesses, its parks, its architecture, its history, its overall uniqueness and all the people who make it special. I will comment on anything that I feel threatens all that.

Sadly, I still can't tell you who I am, for the reasons given in one of my earliest posts (see Why is whistler anonymous).

Finally, a note on freedom, respect and privacy.

I allow everyone to comment on this site freely, without editing or deletion (even Pennypacker, who seems to think swearing in print is acceptable in a site open to all ages). I see this blog as a forum for all, and I do mean all, who wish to make their feelings known, whether I agree with them or not. I allow you to comment anonymously so you are free to say whatever you want (as long as it isn't libellous) without fear of ridicule or retribution. I may comment on what you say - that is my right as much as yours. I respect your right to anonymity and privacy and I don't think it's too much to ask that you respect mine.

Now please stop messing about and get back to saving Greenwich Market (and please don't swear).

Here be dragons

Whistler had an email from an FoW:-

Hi Whistler

Have a look at the following

www.streetsensation.co.uk/markets.htm

You may notice something missing.

The area shown doesn't extend to Greenwich, but you'd think there'd be a mention. This is supposed to be a map of markets that are all within easy reach of Central London. According to TfL, it takes between 37 and 50 minutes to get from Charing Cross to Shepherds Bush Market (which is shown), but only between 23 to 28 minutes to get to Greenwich Market. Ho hum.

Pennypacker writes...

I've had a delightful little comment on "Pandora's tin of worms", which so jaw-droppingly misses the point of this site that I reproduce it in its entirety here:-

I'm a Trader, and I've got to say that this blog has got to be a joke right?

A recession has kicked in, and its hitting small business harder than everyone else. This is because we don't have the marketing strength / large enough customer base to sustain a reasonable volume of sales through the rough periods.

We keep strict sales information and have noticed a change in customer spending habits. Customers are purchasing fewer expensive items and focusing more on our lower price points.

If your business is flexible, and you are smart enough to identify this, and then adjust your business accordingly – you stand a good chance at riding it out.

Those that aren't smart or flexible (or just stubborn – usually the traders who have been there for twenty years+) are starting to get hit hard, and in turn blaming the market and the management for THEIR loss of trade. It's funny how this blog appeared at the same time time things started getting financially rough for us in the market.

You'd be better off spending your time improving your business rather than moaning about the market. Remember USM / GSM are just landlords, and are not responsible for your success in the market. Ha! I bet I can even guess who wrote this blog. That's so lame.

– Pennypacker

I invite comments from you all.

Give a little whistle

I popped into the market a couple of times on Sunday and I greatly enjoyed overhearing traders' conversations as always. Sadly, the lack of business was still an issue. Many arts and crafts traders had a terrible day and were lamenting their decision to bother turning up. The view generally was that the whole week was a disaster.

On a brighter note, not wishing to blow my own bugle, many people were talking about this blog and the atmosphere seemed to me lighter as a result. Much of the talk was speculation about who the Whistler might be. Among the suspects were six different traders, two members of the public who've been seen chatting to traders, one shopkeeper and even Barmy! I'd love to let you in on the secret, but all I can tell you at this point is - you're all wrong! I look forward to next week's speculation.

By the way, thank you for your contributions so far. Please keep them coming.

What a fine fellow

Greenwich Hospital have invited Eric Reynolds, the director of USM and GSM, to submit a proposal for the structure to temporarily house the market while the "island site" is redeveloped. I'm sure Greenwich Market is in safe hands; Eric was recently honoured by the Royal Institute of British Architects (RIBA).

The RIBA Honorary Fellowships for 2008 were presented at the Royal Gold Medal and Fellowships Dinner on the 12th February. Honoured for "his major contribution as a client to the urban regeneration of London and to the conservation of historic buildings", none other than Eric Reynolds.

I'm certain we can look forward to an exciting structure that will not only satisfy every requirement of the Hospital, the World Heritage site, the Council and the market traders, but will also draw huge numbers of visitors to Greenwich to gaze in awe at its latest attraction.

Missing, presumed irrelevant

After an embarrassing first brush back in 2005/6 with the idea of town centre redevelopment which was noisily opposed and withdrawn, Greenwich Hospital regrouped to propose a more sympathetic plan.

In January 2007 the Key Stakeholder Consultative Group (KSCG) was set up by Greenwich Hospital to "provide a forum for consultation on a vision for the regeneration and improvement of the Hospital's core property within the World Heritage Site, in particular the Greenwich 'Island Site' - including the market". Chaired by the Member of Parliament for Greenwich, Nick Raynsford, its original members were:-

• Greenwich Hospital
• London Borough of Greenwich
• Greenwich Foundation
• National Maritime Museum
• Greenwich Town Centre Traders Association
• Urban Space Management
• Town Centre Residents
• Chamber of Commerce
• Greenwich Peninsula Partnership
• The Greenwich Society

The list of interests represented was brief but comprehensive. The first and second meetings went ahead and, as well as those interests above, were attended by:-

• Nelson Bakewell
• Hopkins Architects
• Communique
• Drivers Jonas (2nd meeting)

The sharp-eyed among those of you familiar with the market will notice a glaring omission - market traders. In spite of being one of the most potentially affected groups, no trader was invited to the meetings. According to the OFFICIAL Greenwich Market website, "Over 700 small businesses trade with us every year", so it's hard to believe the Hospital didn't think to include them.

I'm sure USM's founding (and only) director and KSCG representative Eric Reynolds was surprised to find no market traders' representative at the meetings and I assume only shock prevented him from expressing his outrage at this omission.

I am advised that the reason for there being no market trader at the meetings was that USM had informed the Hospital prior to the founding of the group that the traders were happy to be represented by USM. As far as I know, traders have still to find one other trader who had given their approval to USM's representation of them. No-one had been approached by USM for their approval. No market trader even knew that the KSCG existed until after the first meeting.

USM's claim to represent the market traders was indeed outrageous, but I doubt they were being truly duplicitous, Perhaps Eric was ill-advised by his people on the ground in Greenwich, though I'm quite sure Barmy wouldn't betray the traders and mislead his employer by suggesting that he had canvassed traders' opinion. In any event, I have no doubt that Eric would have been unaware of these shenanigans as he is a well-known admirer of designers and artists, which many traders at Greenwich still are.

Anyway, I'm delighted to say that when the situation was drawn to their attention, the KSCG immediately invited the traders to the table and their representative has performed the task with integrity and vigour.

Time flees

What's happened to the market clock? It hasn't worked since Christmas but now it's disappeared. Having a non-working clock in the market was risible anyway (given where we are I think visitors expect to be able to believe in the accuracy of our public clocks), so I don't understand why it was left in that state for months. Now it's gone with no word of explanation. One can only hope that someone's having it fixed and will replace it soon.

Categorise that

A correspondent asks:

...what do your categories mean? I can make sense of some of them but what about Et to brute?

Well it's actually Et Tu Brute and it's Latin. As "Et tu, Brute?" (And you, Brutus) the words were uttered by Julius Caesar in Shakespeare's play before being stabbed by one he could have expected to defend him. I use it in a similar way to categorise posts concerning a betrayal by those who should be extending support and succour.

I confess a number of my categories are little obscure. I'll give a virtual prize to anyone who can provide the right meaning for a category and explain why I might have chosen it.

Opera John - info please

I've had couple of emails reminding me that Opera John died a week ago today and pointing out that no-one (official) seems to have acknowledged his contribution to the market's personality over the years.

I'll be posting a tribute to John as soon as possible, so can you please email me at whistler @ hushmail.com with any info, photos, anecdotes and so forth. Thanks.

Earth calling USM

If you'd like a taste of how out of touch with the market Urban Space Management is, just take a look at their wonderful website (at http://www.urbanspace.com/greenwich_market.html).

The first line says:

The Royal Charter covered market is situated in the heart of London’s “Millennium Village” and has over two and a half million visitors a year.

That's odd - I thought the Millennium Village was in the Greenwich peninsula, nowhere near Greenwich Market.

Do watch the slideshow while you're at the website and indulge in a bit of nostalgia at all those traders, artists, goods and "Greenwich Market" signs that just aren't there any more.

The website is also a great place to get clued up on how many markets USM don't manage any more.

A bit more of a barney

I had a lot of emails last night about one topic; so many I've only just managed to sort out the full picture.

So it was true. I reported in "A bit of a barney" the terrible news that Barmy (my thanks to an anonymous commenter for that one) himself would be "managing" the market yesterday - and so it came to pass. Ben seems to have been shoved out to Elephant & Castle so Barmy has a free hand to screw up the weekdays as effectively as the weekends. How's he getting on?

According to my informants, brilliantly. He began by taking until almost 10 am to allocate half a dozen traders - finished before 9 if Ben's in charge. As always, the Chinese were dealt with last. The last trader to turn up (Chinese actually) was made to wait while he enjoyed a chat with some of the antiques guys before being allocated a pitch. Making a dog's breakfast of that simple task wasn't enough though.

One Chinese trader, who has always had the same pitch for years, was declared "regular" rather than "permanent", meaning Barmy could give away her normal pitch on a whim. He tried, she resisted and got her pitch. He continued the dispute later in front of other traders and the public (very much his style and the subject of a forthcoming post). If Barmy gets his way - and when doesn't he - she'll be out by the toilets next week.

He's in again today - can't wait to hear from you guys...

A trader writes...

Here's another email that I feel moved to reproduce pretty much in its entirety (I have made edits to protect its sender's anonymity).

[We] are former traders ... for over five years ... and apart from the sheer volume of work our stall created thoroughly enjoyed the camaraderie etc. of the market. What we noticed was the steady decline of goods which the management permitted onto the shop floor. When we started one had to pass a quality test and competition was high . This resulted in a fantastic cross section of genuine crafts which in turn pollinated the large footfall. Then came all day opening of the pubs and the daily 1530 flurry of sales dissipated. Management changed and the onslaught of cheap / nasty imports followed...creativity was annulled by traders merely arriving packed to the gills with store bought whatevers. Management were entirely to blame and lo and behold the rents escalated. One by one the old faithfuls dropped out unable to make ends meet and to day I believe a maximum of four traders are still grinding out a subsistence-more out of habit than anything else.

So the point of my e-mail is not to whinge but to actually analyse the demise....a few key factors

* Greenwich council / hospital trust that owns the market obviously have a futuristic "big picture" to develop the square
* Single ownership of ALL surrounding pubs/restaurants - excessive prices / lack of competition
* Tatty goods
* Poor market management
* Escalating rents
* Etc etc

Perm any two from this list along with your thoughts and lets devise a rescue plan ....or be dragged down with apathy.

I value traders' views of their experience of the market. More please.

Communiquétion

I sent Greenwich Hospital an email today to enquire about the Key Stakeholder Consultative Group minutes, which I think are a tad tardy:-

I note from your website that as of today (11th June 2008) the minutes of the KSCG meeting held on the 28th April have not been posted. I would be grateful if would let me know when they will be.

Greenwich Hospital use an outfit called Communiqué to keep the media (and the great unwashed, for that matter) at arms length. That seems perfectly reasonable to me, as they shouldn't be wasting your money on PR staff when they can get someone else to do it for them more economically and effectively. One supposes that the newsletters, publishing of minutes and website are all handled by Communiqué, so could Greenwich Hospital please encourage them to Communiquéte?

A breath of stale air

I've been left such a good comment on the "atmosphere" in the market that I feel it should be reproduced in its entirety here:-

Climate change is hitting Greenwich Market

Anyone walking through the market recently, on a hot & busy weekend will have noticed the hot & sticky atmosphere _____airlessness ___ & that it's a few degrees hotter & more humid than in the sun.
It's the greenhouse affect ___so what's new?
Some Wally thought they could play with the architecture & put up a splash guard between the main roof & the roof above the surrounding shops. This was to protect the edge stalls from getting wet when it rains. An admirable idea, but not thought through.
This was done in spring, when the main weather ahead should ( with a little luck ) be sunny & warm.
This splash guard has the affect of stopping the circulation of air , increasing the heat & humidity,plus making it unbearable for visitors and traders alike.
We haven't even got to the height of Summer yet. People won't come in on sunny days , if its going to be stinky hot and humid.
Who gave planing permission for this ?
The splash guard seems to be permanent ___ no hinge or slide arrangement , to open it up & let the air circulate
OPEN IT UP AND LET US BREATH
As a regular visitor to the market, I hope something will be done about this before the real heat of summer kicks in.
Stinky Hot of Greenwich

Says it all.

Basket case

Today, "Nostalgic Trader" commented on "Every picture tells a story":

And I remember the days when we had hanging baskets going round the whole market. They looked beautiful at this time of year.

How right you are. As far as I remember they were all around the market, fully stocked year round and were watered daily. In March 2004, though not at their summer peak, they looked like this...

...but in April 2008, the same view looks somewhat different:

I can't remember when the baskets were removed, but I have many photographs from the intervening period and not one shows a trace of greenery. I've also just noticed, and remembered, the "sails" that were suspended from and softened the outline of the roof's cross-members. Also gone.

A web of deceit

It's been quite a day today. Every time I think I've done my last post for the day, another email flops onto my doormat. The latest concerns my previous post - here's the nub:-

...when you view the [Greenwich Market] site freshly each time you get a new main picture. As far as I can see there are two that might come up. One of them is a bit of a cheat as it wasn't taken on a Wednesday. See if you can see what's wrong with the other one.

Well, I love a challenge and I did laugh when I spotted the cheekiness. Most of the time one views the page this is what appears:

As my correspondent points out, this bustling scene doesn't depict a Wednesday, but was clearly taken on a Saturday or Sunday. Anyone who has been to the Wednesday market may have noticed more tumbleweed than traders (or customers). I do think it's a little naughty to suggest to visitors that they'll be enjoying a vibrant market. Still, at least it's Greenwich...

Sometimes this picture appears instead:

Initially my eye was drawn to the juicy peppers. Then the prices. I did detect a certain wrongness straight away but it took a few moments to fully understand my correspondent's comment. If you haven't spotted it yet, let me pose you a question: where the hell is this? Check out the stall design, the buildings and the clear daylight. This wasn't taken in Greenwich Market! I'm doubtful this is even Greenwich.

I like to be helpful, so here's another picture for USM to put on their site - I'd say it's as relevant, local and truthful as the OFFICIAL pictures.

A sign of the times - revisited

I just left a comment on the original post concerning the Food Market signs, but I think I should make more of it here. The OFFICIAL (never understood why they feel the need to shout about it) Greenwich Market website is, rightly, promoting its new food offering. The site is at http://www.greenwichmarket.net/ Here's what the home page looks like today:

All well and good, but what's missing? Just like the new blue banners, there's no mention whatever of arts, crafts, antiques or anything else. Just food. Note to traders - jack it in and start flogging food. Or fight back.

A bit of a barney

It has been reported that raised voices were heard in the market twice this weekend. I'm told the manager and his assistant were having a "spirited" discussion and that yesterday the manager was engaged in a similarly amplified conference with some of the market porters. Any information?

Viva Italia!

I do apologise for giving you nothing to fume about over the weekend, but I was obliged to devote a little attention to matters domestic. I did take time out to wander Greenwich and pass through the market. Were my perceptions off kilter or was it even quieter than usual? Sunday seemed worse than Saturday, though there is a partial explanation for that - the Italian market.

One can hardly blame the Italian market traders (or the Indian ones the week before, or the French ones ad nauseam) for wanting to profit from the effort the people, traders, business owners and institutions of Greenwich put into making this place such a great destination for visitors. But surely it's hard enough for the locals at this time without Greenwich council sticking the boot in.

Why does Greenwich council persist in promoting these "continental" markets at the expense of its indigenous ones. Yesterday's Italian food market was featured in the centre of the council's web site home page (go to http://www.greenwich.gov.uk/Greenwich/), with its own page promoting the traders and products. Even more invidious is that website's Markets page (at http://www.greenwich.gov.uk/Greenwich/LeisureCulture/Markets/) - Greenwich Market is third on the list, the Village Market is fourth and the Clock Tower Market doesn't even rate a mention. The Continental Markets are first on the list! Thanks for your support, Greenwich Council.

Pandora's tin of worms

What an amazing tin of worms this Pandora's box is turning out to be. Looks like I'll have to buckle down and put my shoulder to the wheel while my nose is at the grindstone. This whole thing is making me mix metaphors and crank out clichés. And alliterate over much. To the point...

This blog's only been out there for a few days and I've already been deluged with information, much of it leaving me, by turns, disturbed, maddened, affronted and stunned. Now I know I'm doing something necessary and I'm hungry for more information. If you have anything you think needs to be exposed, email me.

I'll be working my way through all your contributions and posting new stuff soon. Thank you.

Every picture tells a story

What a difference ten years makes. Here's a picture of the Coach corner of the market in 1998.


And here's how it looks ten years later.


I'm speechless.

A sign of the times?

I've been asked to draw attention to the strange attitude to signage in Greenwich Market these days. I'm sure regular visitors and traders can remember the banner above the market floor that advertised the opening times for the benefit of all. This was removed last year (for the Christmas decorations?) and six months on still hasn't been restored. In April 2008 three new banners did go up advertising the new Wednesday food market, due to start on the 7th May. The two inside the market looked like this...

...and the one outside like this.


Spot anything odd? Imagine you're a visitor to Greenwich. Perhaps you've heard about the famous arts & crafts market or the antiques & collectibles market. Perhaps you're looking for a shop that offers something the chains outside the DLR don't have. Well you're not likely to start looking for them in a food market, are you?

I understand there was a consensus among other traders that the new Wednesday market should be given a break, so they said nothing about the possible negative impact on their trade until after the new market launched. Decent bunch, eh? So imagine their chagrin that in mid-May, more than three weeks after they were first erected and after the Wednesday market's second week of opening, the signs were still there...

...and at the end of May...

...and today, the 5th of June.

Apparently footfall, and hence income, has been down for non-food businesses since the signs went up. I have heard reports of visitors expressing surprise upon wandering in and finding shops and arts and crafts stalls. Some traders have reported being asked by visitors why they are packing up at 5:30, when the sign clearly says they should be open until 7 pm. And there's still no banner advertising the general market.

Don't get me wrong - I'm delighted the market's food traders are being promoted at last. It's just that the last time I looked, Greenwich market was a place of arts, crafts, antiques and unique shops plus a food court. Not just a food market. Note to the management: please wake up and ditch these signs. How about signs promoting all the market's businesses?

Do the markets matter to Greenwich?

To offer one example, the World Heritage Organisation website for Greenwich says on its homepage (at http://www.greenwichwhs.org.uk/): “So near to central London yet only 20 minutes from the city centre, Greenwich is a place of contrasts, from awe-inspiring architecture, tranquil open spaces and breathtaking views to cosy pubs and bustling street markets.” On its page about shopping in Greenwich (at http://www.greenwichwhs.org.uk/shopping/index.asp), the covered market is the main feature. It says: “From Thursday to Sunday, its cobbled stones are packed with traders’ stalls selling arts, crafts, antiques and collectables plus a food court at weekends.” About the Greenwich markets generally it says: “The markets are a major attraction for visitors and locals giving the streets and alleyways of Greenwich an extra buzz at weekends and bank holidays.” This is only one example of information for visitors to Greenwich recognising the value of the market.